Demolishing the Sethite Theory with Historical Facts
Rob Skiba studies the Bible and the ancients in reference to Genesis 6:1-4, and on Facebook presents a beautiful refutation of the silly “Sethite Theory” which NONE of the ancients believed in. (It seems the ancients were thousands of years closer to the events, and would have a much better understanding than you or me. Duuuuh.) Look at the voluminous collection of proof that the Sons of God were fallen angels who had illicit relations with women and together produced an ungodly and unnatural offspring – the Nephilim. By the way, Rob’s material is NOT comprehensive (He encourages further study), and one can go on and on and on, further validating what the ancients already knew. Blessings, Pastor Steve <><
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September 15, 2015 at 6:19 PMPublic
Genesis 6:
1 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them,
2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose.
3 And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.
4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
From time to time, various people will write to me, attempting to refute the angelic view of the above Scripture. The alternate view is often referred to as the Sethite Theory. That thesis suggests that the “sons of God” is a reference to the good sons of Seth and the “daughters of men” is a reference to the bad daughters of Cain. This is the dominant view taught in seminaries today and now many in the Torah/Messianic community are beginning to teach the same bogus nonsense.
The simple fact of that matter is, the angelic view of the “sons of God” is a Biblical and historical fact, the understanding of which was held by virtually everyone until the 3rd Century AD. You have to literally ignore massive amounts of data to believe otherwise. Furthermore, you’d have to employ eisegesis in your interpretation of Scripture, which leads to all sorts of gross error. There is absolutely nothing in Genesis 6, which in any way refers to Seth or Cain or their offspring. Rather the phrase “sons of God” is a reference applied to angels, just as it was in the book of Job (which actually predates Genesis):
Job 38:1 Then the Lord answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said,
2 Who is this that darkeneth counsel by words without knowledge?
3 Gird up now thy loins like a man; for I will demand of thee, and answer thou me.
4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.
5 Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?
6 Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;
7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?
Were the alleged “good sons of Seth” there at the time of Creation? No. They were not. However, the angels were – as various Biblical commentaries also agree:
Barnes’ Notes on the Bible on Job 38:7…
When the morning-stars – There can be little doubt that angelic beings are intended here, though some have thought that the stars literally are referred to, and that they seemed to unite in a chorus of praise when another world was added to their number. The Vulgate renders it, astra matutina, morning-stars; the Septuagint, ὅτε ἐγενήθηναι ἄστρα hote egenēthēnai astra – ” when the stars were made:” the Chaldee, “the stars of the zephyr,” or “morning” – צפר כוכבי. The comparison of a prince, a monarch, or an angel, with a star, is not uncommon; compare the notes at Isaiah 14. The expression “the morning-stars” is used on account of the beauty of the principal star which, at certain seasons of the year, leads on the morning. It is applied naturally to those angelic beings that are of distinguished glory and rank in heaven. That it refers to the angels, seems to be evident from the connection; and this interpretation is demanded in order to correspond with the phrase “sons of God” in the other member of the verse.Sang together – United in a grand chorus or concert of praise. It was usual to celebrate the laying of a cornerstone, or the completion of an edifice, by rejoicing; see Zechariah 4:7; Ezra 3:10.And all the sons of God – Angels – called the sons of God from their resemblance to him, or their being created by him.Shouted for joy – That is, they joined in praise for so glorious a work as the creation of a new world. They saw that it was an event which was fitted to honor God.Pulpit Commentary on Job 38:7…And all the sons of God shouted for joy. “The sons of God” here must necessarily be the angels (see Job 1:6; Job 2:1), since there were no men as yet in existence. They too joined in the chorus of sympathy and admiration, perhaps lifting up their voices (Revelation 5:11, 12), perhaps their hearts only, praising the Creator, who had done such marvellous things.Gill’s Exposition of the Entire Bible on Job 38:7 (NOTE: this one actually plays into your Hebrew breakdown of the term “sons of God”)……and all the sons of God shouted for joy; which are usually understood of angels also, so the Targum; who are the sons of God, not by birth, as Christ, nor by adoption, as saints; but by creation, as Adam, Luke 3:38. And because they bear some likeness to God, as holy spirits, and honour and obey him in doing his will; though the character of sons of God, as distinct from the children of men, given to professors of religion, obtained before the times of Job; see Genesis 6:2; and who might be said to sing together, and shout for joy, when they met for social worship; see Job 1:6; and especially when any fresh discoveries were made to them of the Messiah, and salvation by him.Jamieson-Faussett-Brown Bible Commentary on Job 38:7……morning stars—especially beautiful. The creation morn is appropriately associated with these, it being the commencement of this world’s day. The stars are figuratively said to sing God’s praises, as in Ps 19:1; 148:3. They are symbols of the angels, bearing the same relation to our earth, as angels do to us. Therefore they answer to “sons of God,” or angels, in the parallel. See on [549]Job 25:5.Matthew Poole’s Commentary on Job 38:7…The sons of God, as it here follows, the latter clause of the verse being explicatory of the former, as is most frequent in this and some other books of Scripture, to wit, the angels, who may well be called stars, as even men of eminent note, and particularly ministers of God’s word, are called, Daniel 8:10 12:3 Revelation 1:16,20; and morning stars, because of their excellent lustre and glory, for which they are called angels of light, 2 Corinthians 11:14, and Christ for the same reason is called the Morning Star, Revelation 22:16. The sons of God; the blessed angels; for man not being yet made, God had then no other sons; and these are called the sons of God, partly because they had their whole being from him, and partly because they were made partakers of his Divine and glorious image. And all these are said to join in this work of praising God, probably because none of the angels were as yet fallen from their first estate, though they did fall within a very little time after.
I could go on, but hopefully, you get the point. Job predates Genesis. The term “sons of God” in Job was understood to be angels. Thus, it is also understood exactly the same way in Genesis 6. This is not confirmed by just “two or three witnesses” either. It is confirmed by the entire Ancient Near Eastern historical record (including in the canonized and non-canonized Hebrew texts)!
Here’s the issue: If you toss out the well documented historical, Hebraic understanding of the Nephilim as the offspring of angels (and genetic tampering), you basically turn YHWH into a schizophrenic, prejudice God who is into random acts of genocide. Why? Because with the Sethite view, you have no plausible explanation for why YHWH would allow the Israelites to take women, children and animals as spoils of war in some military campaigns, while in others, they are commanded to “utterly destroy” everything – including the women, children and animals. A careful reading of the Scriptures in the Torah and elsewhere, wherein the Israelites are commanded to utterly destroy everything is consistently found to be within the context of the Nephilim. Without the hybrid understanding, you also have no explanation for the descriptions of the Canaanites given all through the Scriptures either. For instance, you’d be hard-pressed to find a reasonable answer as to why proud parents would name their newborn children things like “terror” (Heth – Genesis 10:15) and “enclosure of wrath” (Hamathite – Genesis 10:18). And I’m sorry, but kissing cousins simply do not produce “cedar tree” sized Amorite giants (Amos 2:9) who are of “great stature” (Numbers 13:28-33).
And to top it all off, Sethite theorists have no reasonable explanation for the numerous accounts of giants found all over the world (both pre-and post-Flood). They can ignore the “DNA tampering issues” too if they’d like, but then they’ll have no explanation for characters like this either:
And no. Cranial head-boarding does not account for 25-40% larger brains and the totally different suture patterns, as well as the other anomalies often associated with these skulls. Those people were born that way and skulls like this have been found all over the world. Recent DNA testing has shown that they are “not quite human” either. Yes, they have human DNA, but they also have “other DNA” as well. This of course – at least in my mind – perfectly conforms with the Nephilim thesis as laid out in the ancient texts, which you must ignore to hold to the Sethite views. Furthermore, you must also deny the fact of animal-human hybridization taking place (as reported in mainstream news) in our days, just as it was “in the days of Noah.”
The canonized texts alone provide ample reason to accept the angelic view, but if you include the testimonies of Enoch and Jubilees, that view is absolutely unmistakable. Some claim that Enoch has been “grossly mistranslated and misinterpreted,” but the burden is on them to prove it. You can’t just make that claim, based on opinion. And not only would you have to prove there were errors in translation, but also that entire chapters, which clearly describe the issue of the “angels that sinned” in great detail, have to be completely cut out of the text.
As I said above, today, unfortunately the so-called “Sethite view” is what is taught in seminaries and now many Messianic and “Torah Teachers” are perpetuating the same entirely unsubstantiated nonsense. But to accept this view is to deny the massive weight of an enormous amount of ancient testimony – first and foremost the Biblical text, then the Biblically-endorsed texts (such as Enoch and Jubilees) and finally, the testimonies of historians and so-called, “Church Fathers” and other early and recent Christian apologetic authors – just a handful of which are quoted below. I don’t want to do your homework for you, but this is surely enough to get you started on your own…
Writing at some point prior to 50 AD (at the same time as the Apostles), the Hellenistic Jewish philosopher, Philo wrote:
On what principle it was that giants were born of angels and women? (Gen. 6:4). The poets call those men who were born out of the earth giants, that is to say, sons of the Earth {the Greek name Gigas is said to be derived from geμ and gennaoμ, “to bring forth.”} But Moses here uses this appellation improperly, and he uses it too very often merely to denote the vast personal size of the principal men, equal to that of Hajk {hajk is an addition of the Armenian translator; it is the name of a fabulous patriarch of the Armenian nation} or Hercules. But he relates that these giants were sprung from a combined procreation of two natures, namely, from angels and mortal women; for the substance of angels is spiritual; but it occurs every now and then that on emergencies occurring they have imitated the appearance of men, and transformed themselves so as to assume the human shape; as they did on this occasion, when forming connections with women for the production of giants. But if the children turn out imitators of the wickedness of their mothers, departing from the virtue of their fathers, let them depart, according to the determination of the will of a depraved race, and because of their proud contempt for the supreme Deity, and so be condemned as guilty of voluntary and deliberate wickedness. But sometimes Moses styles the angels the sons of God, inasmuch as they were not produced by any mortal, but are incorporeal, as being spirits destitute of any body; or rather that exhorter and teacher of virtue, namely Moses, calls those men who are very excellent and endowed with great virtue the sons of God; and the wicked and depraved men he calls bodies, or flesh.
– Philo, Questions and Answers on Genesis, Book 1, Point # 92
He thus describes the Israelite encounter with the Post-Flood giants when they spied out the land of Canaan…
They also surveyed all the strongest cities, looking upon them in two points of view; first, with reference to their advantages of situation, and also to the strength of their fortification; also, when they inquired respecting the inhabitants, they saw that they were very numerous indeed, and giants of exceeding tallness with absolutely gigantic bodies, both as to their magnitude and their strength.
– Philo On The Life of Moses, 1, Chapter XLI
Clement of Rome is said to have been a disciple of Peter, who lived at the close of the first century. The following is attributed to his writings…
“All things therefore being completed which are in heaven, and in earth, and in the waters, and the human race also having multiplied, in the eighth generation, righteous men, who had lived the life of angels, being allured by the beauty of women, fell into promiscuous and illicit connections with these; and thenceforth acting in all things without discretion, and disorderly, they changed the state of human affairs and the divinely prescribed order of life, so that either by persuasion or force they compelled all men to sin against God their Creator. In the ninth generation are born the giants, so called from of old,not dragon-footed, as the fables of the Greeks relate, but men of immense bodies, whose bones, of enormous size, are still shown in some places for confirmation. But against these the righteous providence of God brought a flood upon the world, that the earth might be purified from their pollution, and every place might be turned into a sea by the destruction of the wicked. Yet there was then found one righteous man, by name Noah, who, being delivered in an ark with his three sons and their wives, became the colonizer of the world after the subsiding of the waters, with those animals and seeds which he had shut up with him.”
– Recognitions of Clement, Book 1, Chapter XXIX, The Giants: The Flood
“The ten pairs of which we have spoken have therefore been assigned to this world from the beginning of time. Cain and Abel were one pair. The second was the giants and Noah; the third, Pharaoh and Abraham; the fourth, the Philistines and Isaac; the fifth, Esau and Jacob; the sixth, the magicians and Moses the lawgiver; the seventh, the tempter and the Son of man; the eighth, Simon and I, Peter; the ninth, all nations, and he who shall be sent to sow the word among the nations; the tenth, Antichrist and Christ. Concerning these pairs we shall give you fuller information at another time.” When Peter spoke thus, Aquila said: “Truly there is need of constant teaching, that one may learn what is true about everything.”
– Recognitions of Clement, Book III, Chapter LXI,Ten Pairs
From the Clementine Homilies:
Chapter XIII.-The Fall of the Angels.
But when, having assumed these forms, they convicted as covetous those who stole them, and changed themselves into the nature of men, in order that, living holily, and showing the possibility of so living, they might subject the ungrateful to punishment, yet having become in all respects men, they also partook of human lust, and being brought tinder its subjection they fell into cohabitation with women; and being involved with them, and sunk in defilement and altogether emptied of their first power, were unable to turn back to the first purity of their proper nature, their members turned away from their fiery substance: for the fire itself, being extinguished by the weight of lust, and changed into flesh, they trode the impious path downward. For they themselves, being fettered with the bonds of flesh, were constrained and strongly bound; wherefore they have no more been able to ascend into the heavens.
Chapter XV.-The Giants.
But from their unhallowed intercourse spurious men sprang, ranch greater in stature than ordinary men, whom they afterwards called giants; not those dragon-footed giants who waged war against God, as those blasphemous myths of the Greeks do sing, but wild in manners, and greater than men in size, inasmuch as they were sprung of angels; yet less than angels, as they were born of women. Therefore God, knowing that they were barbarized to brutality, and that the world was not sufficient to satisfy them (for it was created according to the proportion of men and human use), that they might not through want of food turn, contrary to nature, to the eating of animals, and yet seem to be blameless, as having ventured upon this through necessity, the Almighty God rained manna upon them, suited to their various tastes; and they enjoyed all that they would. But they, on account of their bastard nature, not being pleased with purity of food, longed only after the taste of blood. Wherefore they first tasted flesh.
Chapter XVIII.-The Law to the Survivors.
Since, therefore, the souls of the deceased giants were greater than human souls, inasmuch as they also excelled their bodies, they, as being a new race, were called also by a new name {demons}. And to those who survived in the world a law was prescribed of God through an angel, how they should live. For being bastards in race, of the fire of angels and the blood of women, and therefore liable to desire a certain race of their own, they were anticipated by a certain righteous law.
– Clement, Homily VIII, Chapters XIII; XV; XVIII
At about the same time, or not long after, the Jewish/Roman historian Josephus wrote:
Now this posterity of Seth continued to esteem God as the Lord of the universe, and to have an entire regard to virtue, for seven generations; but in process of time they were perverted, and forsook the practices of their forefathers; and did neither pay those honors to God which were appointed them, nor had they any concern to do justice towards men. But for what degree of zeal they had formerly shown for virtue, they now showed by their actions a double degree of wickedness, whereby they made God to be their enemy. For many angels of God accompanied with women, and begat sons that proved unjust, and despisers of all that was good, on account of the confidence they had in their own strength; for the tradition is, that these men did what resembled the acts of those whom the Grecians call giants.
– Josephus, Antiquities of the Jews, Book 1, Chapter 3
Then, when describing the events of Genesis 14, Josephus says…
At this time, when the Assyrians had the dominion over Asia, the people of Sodom were in a flourishing condition, both as to riches and the number of their youth. There were five kings that managed the affairs of this county: Ballas, Barsas, Senabar, and Sumobor, with the king of Bela; and each king led on his own troops: and the Assyrians made war upon them; and, dividing their army into four parts, fought against them. Now every part of the army had its own commander; and when the battle was joined, the Assyrians were conquerors, and imposed a tribute on the kings of the Sodomites, who submitted to this slavery twelve years; and so long they continued to pay their tribute: but on the thirteenth year they rebelled, and then the army of the Assyrians came upon them, under their commanders Amraphel, Arioch, Chodorlaomer, and Tidal. These kings had laid waste all Syria, and overthrown the offspring of the giants.
– Josephus, Antiquities of the Jews, Book 1, Chapter 9
Regarding the later conquests of Israel, the historian goes on to say…
For which reason they removed their camp to Hebron; and when they had taken it, they slew all the inhabitants. There were till then left the race of giants, who had bodies so large, and countenances so entirely different from other men, that they were surprising to the sight, and terrible to the hearing. The bones of these men are still shown to this very day, unlike to any credible relations of other men.
– Josephus, Antiquities of the Jews, Book 5, Chapter 2.3
Writing sometime prior to 190 AD, Athenagoras of Athens said…
For this is the office of the angels,-to exercise providence for God over the things created and ordered by Him; so that God may have the universal and general providence of the whole, while the particular parts are provided for by the angels appointed over them.90 Just as with men, who have freedom of choice as to both virtue and vice (for you would not either honour the good or punish the bad, unless vice and virtue were in their own power; and some are diligent in the matters entrusted to them by you, and others faithless), so is it among the angels. Some, free agents, you will observe, such as they were created by God, continued in those things for which God had made and over which He had ordained them; but some outraged both the constitution of their nature and the government entrusted to them: namely, this ruler of matter and its various forms, and others of those who were placed about this first firmament (you know that we say nothing without witnesses, but state the things which have been declared by the prophets); these fell into impure love of virgins, and were subjugated by the flesh, and he became negligent and wicked in the management of the things entrusted to him. Of these lovers of virgins, therefore, were begotten those who are called giants. And if something has been said by the poets, too, about the giants, be not surprised at this: worldly Wisdom and divine differ as much from each other as truth and plausibility: the one is of heaven and the other of earth; and indeed, according to the prince of matter, “We know we oft speak lies that look like truths.”
– Athenagoras, A Plea For The Christians, Chapter XXIV.-Concerning the Angels and Giants
These angels, then, who have fallen from heaven, and haunt the air and the earth, and are no longer able to rise to heavenly things, and the souls of the giants, which are the demons who wander about the world, perform actions similar, the one (that is, the demons) to the natures they have received, the other (that is, the angels) to the appetites they have indulged. But the prince of matter, as may be seen merely from what transpires, exercises a control and management contrary to the good that is in God.
– Athenagoras, A Plea For The Christians, Chapter XXV.-The Poets and Philosophers Have Denied a Divine Providence
Writing some time prior to 220AD, Tertullian wrote:
But, you say, in the case of the dead, mortality is already swallowed up of life. No, not in all cases, certainly. For how many will most probably be found of men who had just died-so recently put into their graves, that nothing in them would seem to be decayed? For you do not of course deem a thing to be decayed unless it be cut off, abolished, and withdrawn from our perception, as having in every possible way ceased to be apparent. There are the carcases of the giants of old time; it will be obvious enough that they are not absolutely decayed, for their bony frames are still extant. We have already spoken of this elsewhere. For instance, even lately in this very city, when they were sacrilegiously laying the foundations of the Odeum on a good many ancient graves, people were horror-stricken to discover, after some five hundred years, bones, which still retained their moisture, and hair which had not lost its perfume. It is certain not only that bones remain indurated, but also that teeth continue undecayed for ages-both of them the lasting germs of that body which is to sprout into life again in the resurrection.
– Tertullian, On The Resurrection of the Flesh,
Chapter XLII.-Death Changes, Without Destroying, Our Mortal Bodies. Remains of the Giants
Contemporarily, Marcus Minucius Felix writing sometime before 250AD, wrote:
III. -The Worship of Demons
When Almighty God, to beautify the nature of the world, willed that that earth should be visited by angels, when they were sent down they despised His laws. Such was the beauty of women, that it turned them aside; so that, being contaminated, they could not return to heaven. Rebels from God, they uttered words against Him. Then the Highest uttered His judgment against them; and from their seed giants are said to have been born. By them arts were made known in the earth, and they taught the dyeing of wool, and everything which is done; and to them, when they died, men erected images. But the Almighty, because they were of an evil seed, did not approve that, when dead, they should be brought back from death. Whence wandering they now subvert many bodies, and it is such as these especially that ye this day worship and pray to as gods.
Marcus Minucius Felix, The Instructions of Commodianus in Favour of Christian Discipline. Chapter III
Likewise, at about this same time Julius Africanus, while appearing a bit conflicted about this issue wrote the following – being the first to propose what would later become known as the “Sethite theory” of Genesis 6:1-4…
When men multiplied on the earth, the angels of heaven came together with the daughters of men. In some copies I found “the sons of God.” What is meant by the Spirit, in my opinion, is that the descendants of Seth are called the sons of God on account of the righteous men and patriarchs who have sprung from him, even down to the Saviour Himself; but that the descendants of Cain are named the seed of men, as having nothing divine in them, on account of the wickedness of their race and the inequality of their nature, being a mixed people, and having stirred the indignation of God. But if it is thought that these refer to angels, we must take them to be those who deal with magic and jugglery, who taught the women the motions of the stars and the knowledge of things celestial, by whose power they conceived the giants as their children, by whom wickedness came to its height on the earth, until God decreed that the whole race of the living should perish in their impiety by the deluge.
Again, during this same time period, Bishop Alexander of Cappadocia acknowledged the Jewish historical account (of Genesis) as pertaining to angels…
Jewish history relates that angels came down to hold intercourse with the daughters of men; for this saying signifies that the nutritive powers of the soul descended from heaven to earth.
– Alexander, Of the Manichaeans, Chapter XXV
The Testaments of the Twelve Patriarchs is a constituent of the apocryphalscriptures connected with the Bible. It is a pseudepigraphical workcomprising the dying commands of the twelve sons of acob. It is part of the Oskan Armenian Orthodox Bible of 1666. Fragments of similar writings were found at Qumran, but opinions are divided as to whether these are the same texts. The Testaments were written in Hebrew or Greek, and reached their final form in the 2nd century CE. Regarding the events of Genesis 6, we find…
Therefore flee fornication, my children, and command your wives and your daughters that they adorn not their heads and their faces; because every woman who acteth deceitfully in these things hath been reserved to everlasting punishment. For thus they allured the Watchers before the flood; and as these continually beheld them, they fell into desire each of the other, and they conceived the act in their mind, and changed themselves into the shape of men, and appeared to them in their congress with their husbands; and the women, having in their minds desire toward their apparitions, gave birth to giants, for the Watchers appeared to them as reaching even unto heaven.
– The Testaments of the Twelve Patriarchs, 1 – The Testiment of Reuben Concerning Thoughts
The Kebra Nagast, orThe Glory of the Kings, is a 14th-centuryaccount written inGe’ezof the origins of the Solomonic lineof the Emperorsof Ethiopia. The text, in its existing form, is at least 700 years old and is considered by many Ethiopian Christiansand Rastafarito be an inspired and a reliable work. This is what it had to say about the events of Genesis 6…
And straightway God was wroth with them, and He bound them in the terror of SHEÔL until the day of redemption, as the Apostle saith, “He treated His angels with severity. He spared them not, but made them to dwell in a state of judgement, and they were fettered until the Great Day.” The word of God conquered, Who had fashioned ADAM in His likeness (or, form), and those who had reviled and made a laughingstock of ADAM were conquered. And the daughters of CAIN with whom the angels had companied conceived, but they were unable to bring forth their children, and they died. And of the children who were in their wombs some died, and some came forth; having split open the bellies of their mothers they came forth by their navels. And when they were grown up and reached man’s estate they became giants, whose height reached unto the clouds; and for their sakes and the sakes of sinners the wrath of God became quiet, and He said, “My spirit shall only rest on them for one hundred and twenty years, and I will destroy them with the waters of the Flood,” them and all sinners who have not believed the word of God. And to those who believed the word of their fathers, and did His Will, no injury came from the waters of the Flood, but He delivered them, saying, “If thou believest My word thou canst save thyself from the Flood.”
- The Kebra Nagast, Chapter 100: Concerning the Angels Who Rebelled
This (proper) angelic view of Genesis 6 was the dominant view of antiquity. You simply cannot ignore this fact. It only began to lose ground in the 3rd Century with Julius Africanus, then later with Augustine. Then much later, Calvin came along and really made the bogus “Sethite Theory” view popular. For a great article on this, please read Douglas Hamp’s blog:
Again, in short, you have to literally ignore HUGE AMOUNTS of literary and historical data, as well as the countless reports of giants and the subsequent discoveries of their remains, which have been recorded by numerous cultures all around the world in order to believe and teach the completely bogus Sethite Theory. In my view, anyone who teaches that theory is being exceptionally dishonest with the ancient record as well as with their listeners, proving only an agenda that is absolutely contrary to the facts. As a researcher, I cannot do that. If you subscribe to this Sethite doctrine, I would hope you will now seriously reconsider your wholly unsubstantiated position in this regard.
Sincerely,
– Rob Skiba
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Addendum below by James Sundquist. Note the clear unequivocal exegesis that tells us once again, that “The Sons of God” were angels and their progeny the Nephilim:
If angels are just spirits and not physical beings then why does Jude state that they were bound in chains? Doesn’t this require being a physical being? Please tell me how you put a spirit in chains? And note that both Peter and Jude describe them as being bound in chains. Both Peter and Jude told all Christians that the account of Nephilim judgment was already known to all of them, meaning it was common knowledge in the First Century. It was not unknown or concealed or a mystery that needed to be revealed or explained. Both Apostles were simply reminding them and warning them of how seriously God took it. In fact all of the revered church fathers held this view until St. John of Chrysostom (born 347 AD), and Augustine (born 354 AD), such as Clement of Rome (35 AD), and contemporary of the Apostle John), Justin Martyr (2nd Century), Irenaeus (202 AD), Ambrose (4th Century), and myriads other Saints. Conclusion: There is no good biblical motivation to change. There are no dead wicked humans in Tartarus. So it would have to be empty if no fallen angels are in it, so there would be no reason even for its existence! The motivation in the Roman Catholic Church to propagate that the Nephilim as humans vs. fallen angel offspring was nefarious, which was antisemitism and Replacement Theology, with John Calvin taking the baton pass from Augustine. From the Book of Genesis on, you have a only two choices: Stand with Israel or Abandon Israel!: “I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you.” Genesis 12:1-3 So why should we be so shocked? And yet to this day, most Christian Denominations do not take Genesis 6 and 12 literally.
True-
They say a picture is worth a thousand words. I read this story a couple of years ago and recently revisited it because I wanted to share this legend with a friend. Here is where it gets really interesting and my when my jaw went slack. Take a good and close look at one of our little endangered friends. Now do a little research on Aztec jewelry- particularly a golden necklace. When you find the picture of this necklace, please post the picture- it will undoubtedly add another layer of validity to this man’s testimony. If you are ever in need of a diving buddy, I live in Utah!
PS- I have seen those sketches of Brewer’s mummies on Steve Quayle’s website. I believe he has them listed under the heading of “Utah Giants”? Any local Native American legends that merit his claims?
Faithfully yours in the Everliving God and His Son the King of Kings,
David Crain
Thanks, David. Oh yes, my friend, these pictures are literally the tip of giant iceberg. The “amber snails” are found only in a very few locales in South America, I understand. I was present when Childs attempted to drill into the chamber from the top of the sandstone cliff — the drill rig went into the sandstone like a hot knife through cold butter – until it reached the point near the cavern. At that point, the bit would jump and then break off. This was repeated four times – with the same result.
Then Childs went to the west side, and began tunneling. Eventually, however, the red sandstone refused to budge — it was like trying to drill and blast a steel safe.
It was at that point when Childs accepted there was some sort of ancient “force field” applied to the cavern. This is exactly what was experienced in Romania, as explained in the book “Transylvanian Sunrise” – by Radu Cinnamar and Peter Moon — http://www.skybooksusa.com
Will post updates as they occur.
T.O.
Dave, could you post a link to a webpage with those pictures of Aztec necklaces you’re talking about? I’m very interested to see them and compare with the snails– thanks so much!!!
http://www.angelfire.com/trek/forthetruth/snails.jpg
The similarities are beyond coincedence!
Wow! The pervasive ignorance and mental simplicity on this page, especially in the comments section, is a real treat to behold. With the enormity of the web you’d think displays of such immense soft-headedness from so many individuals in concert would be more common but this one really breaks the mold! It’s almost like satire but you’re all actually serious.
The obvious Mormon claiming not to be a Mormon, having a convenient and public ‘whoa how’d old Joe know that?’ moment. No normal person (read: not mormon person) is ever impressed with Joe Smith or Mormonism in general. Joe was a MASTER MASON, they have reading/study materials in their lodges that you can’t find in a library, your temple ceremony was copied (almost verbatim) from Masonic ceremony (he was Master Mason before he ever produced the temple rites). To the rest of the world you guys look like what the Scientologists look like to you. “They should know better, its just such obvious BS..” Get on YouTube and search “book of abraham” and watch 1or 2 videos critical of the topic, fix your head.
And the reply OP gave fake-non-mormon’s post about necromancy? Good God man, there is no talking to the dead otherwise getting away with murder just became impossible and last I checked? Very possible. Easy even. And your assertion that the Mormons pay the Smithsonian to keep this hush-hush is so cute but misguided. You know those Mormon fools will actually call the Smithsonian from time to time, asking if they can help them find important dig sites with their Book of Mormon? You know what the Smithsonian says right back? “No, we don’t want your help because the Book of Mormon is not a historical document..” Oh and the link you provide in your OP to the 2002 National Geographic article, you might want to actually go read that article… it isn’t what you claim, at all (elephant-esque fossils found, not giant Cyclops humans you tool). And your picture of the Lovelock giant mummy is actually a picture of Ramses II, reverse image search confirms it (make a note to go for a less famous/recognizable mummy when lying in the future).
Next we have little miss PHD in… “forensic archaeology?” Forensic.. archeology..? Do you know what these two words mean? Your desire to be a certain TV character is painfully transparent, Bones, also I’m pretty sure only Google employees get the @google.com email, you’ve got @gmail.com most likely but who knows really since your writing in general paints you as a completely inept short-bus kid. How do you get a PHD, even the fictitious variety found in your possesion, with a 1st or 2nd grade grasp of our language? I have yet to even meet someone that has English as a second language demonstrate the vast incapability you do at typed communication. Stay in school.
I could go on but this is getting pretty long so I just want to finish with a thank you. My message might sound angry or hostile but you’ve all made my morning, God you’re all hilarious and I can’t believe no one’s really called you out on it until now.
Do you know where the artifacts from Johnson canyon are now? Are the artifacts in the photos on this web page the artifacts from the cave? How can I contact the person who now has these artifacts?
Please call me at (435) 275-8315.
IM NOT RACIST BUT WHY DO WHITE PEOPLE ALWAYS TRY TO THROW THEM SELVES INTO THE WORLD THAT MAYANS AND AZTEKS WERE LIVING IN B4 THEY GOT HERE THAT I HATE SO MUCH TALKING ABOUT IT WAS A EUROPEAN BODY FROM B.C FUCK YALL BASTARD DAMN ALWAYS TRYING TO SAY OH THE WHITES WERE HERE B4 HOW IS WE WERE CORRECTION ALREADY BUILT TEMPLES THAT YOU BASTARD CAMEE AND TRIED TO TAKE OVER ..
Chill Dude!!!
nigger
Sorry, that was immature. And please, work on your grammar
I find it amazing that europeans are now trying to claim that which was already here as always. I believe that the 200 bodies found were Natives of this land which were never white.
So ignorant . The thrueth is there a lot we have yet to discover we are still in our infancy in that dept.
I take what these archeologist say with a grain of salt . I believe there is a cover up and there are very ancient things still buried and sometimes hidden from the masses
These were redheads. I don’t know a lot of darker skinned people who have red hair. And they’ve been found all over the world, which makes it even more curious.
But apart from that, I think the point here is that stuff is being covered up. This isn’t a conspiracy to minimize dark-skinned people, it’s an effort to ask “What the heck were these people doing here and why isn’t anyone being given the chance to know about it?” We don’t know a lot about the migration of people in North America. The fact that the indigenous people that we know of ARE darker skinned just makes this more of a mystery.
Those who are looking for the truth aren’t interested in the color of skin, they’re interested in why stuff goes into the Smithsonian and never comes out.
Aztecs, Incas, Mayans all show up in a fairly recent time. They took over others lives,buildings and land, that where there before them. (Damn Bas-turds!) Even the most famous tribe, the Souix took over the Black Hills and called it ‘our ancient land’,’sacred ancestral’ when they in fact came from east of the Mississippi. The NAVAJO NAZIS practiced genocide against the Anasazi (look up Sacred Ridge,Durango,Colorado) even though the Navajo word Anasazi means (Anaa–enemy, Sazi–ancestor) the Nazi Navajo have total controll of the bones. All Dark Hair Indians are Asian transplants. The true ‘natives’ are Mastadons,Horses, and Camels. Princess Winnemucca in her 1883 book ‘Life among the Paiutes’ wrote that there was a Red Hair tribe living in Nevada before her Nazi Paiute tribe migrated there. She wrote about her tribe practicing genocide against that Red Hair tribe of over 2,000 men,women and children because they were not like them.That is extreme racism. She wrote about her tribe saving the Red Hair and making a dress out of it. (Sounds a lot like the Nazis)
The Nazis were extreme nationalist who believed in the superiority of their race. They believed in a totalitarian government, where all opposition is ruthlessly put down. Maybe they got their ideas from American Indians.
Thanks to modern tribes and congress ancient bones can not be tested for DNA. To think every bone in the ground is your ancestor is strange to me.The truth may never be known. The Nazis may win.
In modern times when you see a red haired person they get your attention. Why? Because it is a rare sight. Something like 3% of the earths population has the gift of red hair. 3% out 7 billion people. The majority from North America, Northern Europe and Northern Asia. Even among White Europeans Red Hair is Rare. I would like to know what% of pure blood Asian/American/Indians from South America to Alaska have Red Hair? Or are taller than 5’8
yet there are a lot of black advocates that say that OLMEC WERE BLACK
There are A LOT of RACIST BLACK ADVOCATES that say the Greeks were black, the Romans were black, the Egyptians were black, BLA,BLA,BLA,BLA,BLA. If someone built it they were black. But its funny how little was built in Black Sub Sahara Africa. Or how little was built between north Asia and middle USA. The East coast having the oldest and most building. (Rock shelters in Penn, Ny,Mass,Platform mounds around mouth of Mississippi then moving north,Windover Bog People) Knowing is half the battle,knowledge is being held hostage in boxes at Florida State U. and good ole D.C.
I also find it funny that most of those Racist Black Advocates are 15% – 65% white.
Once you go black, you never go back.
LOL
Creationist “Myths” of red headed giants existing among many other races are widespread
http://www.beforeus.com/email/article/article6_The_Lost_World_of_Giants.html
White Black Yellow or Green . Are the same no matter what Continent they came from. all prayed on the weak and took their lands its still going on in the 3rd world. but every one talks about the whites Europeans for some reason.
For what reason I don’t know but white Europeans were just more advanced with there weapons and ability’s back in the day.
I would like to introduce the idea that ‘giants are giant’ but ‘men of renown are like Einstein or Tesla, and no taller than any other man’. The Nephilim are not ‘giants’ nor are they ‘men of renown’. By what the Nephilim did came both sets, ie: like the twin brothers of Isaac were Jacob and Esau….born at the same time but truly opposite in nature and appearance. Nephilim ‘mated’ by dna research. They were here after the flood of Noah and are still here today. Why is the world so technological…more so than spiritual? They are a technological race and hide well in technological societies, not primitive societies. In primitive societies, such as the cowboy days of old America, these Nephilim would have stuck out like a sore thumb…But, give them a techie society and they blend right in….America has been a good cover for them…and Europe too.